These two are the pivot point for the triggering of the West and for the ensuring of the good of Israel.
Smotrich has not signed off on the legitimization papers for the PA to continue operating as a parasite on the Israeli banking system thus de legitimizing them, the idea was discussed under senile Joe but the punitive measures of the demorrhoids averted that strategy at that time, the plo should have been experiencing hard consequences since the first infraction of Oslo decades ago.
Playing nice is how we got to October 7th.
planning strategy to ensure the nation of Israel stays Jewish and strong.
If a international law existed for malpractice Israel ought to be suing many nations.
Fun fact though it wasn't a sanction, in 56 when England recruited France and Israel to take on Nasser after he nationalized British assets and the three armies successfully took Sinai. Like surprised many with the announcement that he would crash the British pound if troops weren't withdrawn.
Ben Gurion had the sense to get it on paper as the British didn't want to commit, in the end the Israelis were somewhat stranded in Sinai after that accomplishment.
Imagine if that had been kept in Israel hands since then?
With allies like that that will sanction an elected official🧟♀️
I have several thoughts. First, it’s not unusual to sanction foreign officials. The U.S. has sanctioned some 12,000 individuals, some of whom are public officials, including Russian President Vladimir Putin and members of his government involved in the war on Ukraine.
Certainly the U.S. would say most if not all of the sanctioned officials are from authoritarian nations. But Russia and many other authoritarian nations still hold elections. Some scholars argue the current administration in both the U.S. and Israel are moving toward authoritarianism even though elections are still held.
Finally, I don’t think it’s accurate that Israeli voters picked these guys and can vote them out. They are elected Knesset members, but people could only vote for parties. These two were on the lists of minor parties that won a minority of the popular vote but wound up in the cabinet as part of a coalition deal. Nobody voted them into their current positions and nobody can directly vote them out of those jobs. So it seems a stretch to say these sanctions threaten democracy.
Larry- As always, thanks for your comment. I know there are other individual sanctions, but 12,000? I hadn’t been aware it’s that widespread!
I’d just say that personal sanctions of foreign government officials in other contexts still raise these same issues. In addition, in many cases (and even more so usually if the sanctioned individual is a private citizen) there are questions of due process as well. I didn’t bring up due process here with regards to Smotrich and Ben Gvir because their positions truly are well known. But when the Biden administration imposed sanctions on settler leaders, for example, this was because those individuals had allegedly committed violence or other crimes against Palestinians. However, there was no opportunity for these individuals to tell their side of the story or deny the charges (and since the U.S. government lacks criminal jurisdiction there really isn’t any way for it to arrange that.) That would seem to be a basic lack of fairness that a government imposing sanctions on foreigners is most often going to run into.
With regard to Israel’s political system, just remember that Smotrich and Ben Gvir were not unknowns way down their party’s lists that unexpectedly got into the Knesset. Actually, they were actually right at the top and their names and photos were all over their party’s campaign ads. People knew who they were voting for and what to expect when they picked those parties, and the two of them together now control 20 out of the 120 seats in the Knesset, which is quite a bit. I wouldn’t say that sanctions against them threaten democracy, but the reality is that at least in the last election a significant chunk of voters chose them quite knowingly. I don’t think personal sanctions are going to change the minds of those voters, but that’s really what people outraged by the positions that these two politicians take need to do.
All good points. But another nation trying to persuade Israeli voters to oust an elected official would be more foreign interference in a democracy than sanctioning the individual. Whether it’s sanctions or diplomacy or legal action or military force, it all comes down to the question of what the international community can or should do when they see another nation violating international law — and whether any of those options will be effective.
Jewish visitors were permitted to sing and dance openly throughout the entire Temple Mount compound on Wednesday, following a policy directive issued by National Security Minister Itamar Ben-Gvir.
The development represents a dramatic change from past practice, where Jewish prayer—even whispered—on the Temple Mount could lead to arrest, detention or being barred from the site for months.
For decades, Israeli police enforced strict limitations on Jewish religious expression on the Mount, citing security concerns and maintaining the status quo agreement with the Waqf Islamic trust that administers the site.
However, under Ben-Gvir’s new guidelines, police have been instructed to allow Jewish prayers and songs throughout the compound, according to Israel National News.
Israel Police Commissioner Daniel Levy reportedly ordered officers not to restrict Jewish singing on any part of the Mount.
This policy was first publicly hinted at during a meeting held three weeks ago between Ben-Gvir and organizations advocating for greater Jewish access to the Temple Mount.
During that meeting, participants urged the minister to expand permissions for religious expression beyond a single location and to permit singing out loud across the compound.
One activist who regularly ascends the Mount reportedly told Ben-Gvir, “You’ve worked magic since taking office,” adding, “This is a historic transformation we never imagined could happen.”
Ben-Gvir, a frequent visitor to Judaism’s holiest site and known for his advocacy of Jewish rights at the site in Jerusalem’s Olde City, responded during the meeting, “My policy is that singing should be allowed throughout the entire Temple Mount.”
I agree with you there is a basic unfairness that Jewish prayer isn't allowed on the Temple Mount. But at this point we need to also consider the context. What's more important, prayer or peace? God should be able to hear prayers even from afar. If prayer at the Temple Mount right now risks leading to violence and strife, regardless of fair perhaps giving in to the demands of others on this issue may be best path.
These two are the pivot point for the triggering of the West and for the ensuring of the good of Israel.
Smotrich has not signed off on the legitimization papers for the PA to continue operating as a parasite on the Israeli banking system thus de legitimizing them, the idea was discussed under senile Joe but the punitive measures of the demorrhoids averted that strategy at that time, the plo should have been experiencing hard consequences since the first infraction of Oslo decades ago.
Playing nice is how we got to October 7th.
planning strategy to ensure the nation of Israel stays Jewish and strong.
If a international law existed for malpractice Israel ought to be suing many nations.
Fun fact though it wasn't a sanction, in 56 when England recruited France and Israel to take on Nasser after he nationalized British assets and the three armies successfully took Sinai. Like surprised many with the announcement that he would crash the British pound if troops weren't withdrawn.
Ben Gurion had the sense to get it on paper as the British didn't want to commit, in the end the Israelis were somewhat stranded in Sinai after that accomplishment.
Imagine if that had been kept in Israel hands since then?
With allies like that that will sanction an elected official🧟♀️
Ike not like🙄
Voice transcription autocorrect changes text after I view it as correct 🕳️
Yes, I knew you meant Ike.
I have several thoughts. First, it’s not unusual to sanction foreign officials. The U.S. has sanctioned some 12,000 individuals, some of whom are public officials, including Russian President Vladimir Putin and members of his government involved in the war on Ukraine.
Certainly the U.S. would say most if not all of the sanctioned officials are from authoritarian nations. But Russia and many other authoritarian nations still hold elections. Some scholars argue the current administration in both the U.S. and Israel are moving toward authoritarianism even though elections are still held.
Finally, I don’t think it’s accurate that Israeli voters picked these guys and can vote them out. They are elected Knesset members, but people could only vote for parties. These two were on the lists of minor parties that won a minority of the popular vote but wound up in the cabinet as part of a coalition deal. Nobody voted them into their current positions and nobody can directly vote them out of those jobs. So it seems a stretch to say these sanctions threaten democracy.
Larry- As always, thanks for your comment. I know there are other individual sanctions, but 12,000? I hadn’t been aware it’s that widespread!
I’d just say that personal sanctions of foreign government officials in other contexts still raise these same issues. In addition, in many cases (and even more so usually if the sanctioned individual is a private citizen) there are questions of due process as well. I didn’t bring up due process here with regards to Smotrich and Ben Gvir because their positions truly are well known. But when the Biden administration imposed sanctions on settler leaders, for example, this was because those individuals had allegedly committed violence or other crimes against Palestinians. However, there was no opportunity for these individuals to tell their side of the story or deny the charges (and since the U.S. government lacks criminal jurisdiction there really isn’t any way for it to arrange that.) That would seem to be a basic lack of fairness that a government imposing sanctions on foreigners is most often going to run into.
With regard to Israel’s political system, just remember that Smotrich and Ben Gvir were not unknowns way down their party’s lists that unexpectedly got into the Knesset. Actually, they were actually right at the top and their names and photos were all over their party’s campaign ads. People knew who they were voting for and what to expect when they picked those parties, and the two of them together now control 20 out of the 120 seats in the Knesset, which is quite a bit. I wouldn’t say that sanctions against them threaten democracy, but the reality is that at least in the last election a significant chunk of voters chose them quite knowingly. I don’t think personal sanctions are going to change the minds of those voters, but that’s really what people outraged by the positions that these two politicians take need to do.
All good points. But another nation trying to persuade Israeli voters to oust an elected official would be more foreign interference in a democracy than sanctioning the individual. Whether it’s sanctions or diplomacy or legal action or military force, it all comes down to the question of what the international community can or should do when they see another nation violating international law — and whether any of those options will be effective.
Jewish visitors were permitted to sing and dance openly throughout the entire Temple Mount compound on Wednesday, following a policy directive issued by National Security Minister Itamar Ben-Gvir.
The development represents a dramatic change from past practice, where Jewish prayer—even whispered—on the Temple Mount could lead to arrest, detention or being barred from the site for months.
For decades, Israeli police enforced strict limitations on Jewish religious expression on the Mount, citing security concerns and maintaining the status quo agreement with the Waqf Islamic trust that administers the site.
However, under Ben-Gvir’s new guidelines, police have been instructed to allow Jewish prayers and songs throughout the compound, according to Israel National News.
Israel Police Commissioner Daniel Levy reportedly ordered officers not to restrict Jewish singing on any part of the Mount.
This policy was first publicly hinted at during a meeting held three weeks ago between Ben-Gvir and organizations advocating for greater Jewish access to the Temple Mount.
During that meeting, participants urged the minister to expand permissions for religious expression beyond a single location and to permit singing out loud across the compound.
One activist who regularly ascends the Mount reportedly told Ben-Gvir, “You’ve worked magic since taking office,” adding, “This is a historic transformation we never imagined could happen.”
Ben-Gvir, a frequent visitor to Judaism’s holiest site and known for his advocacy of Jewish rights at the site in Jerusalem’s Olde City, responded during the meeting, “My policy is that singing should be allowed throughout the entire Temple Mount.”
I agree with you there is a basic unfairness that Jewish prayer isn't allowed on the Temple Mount. But at this point we need to also consider the context. What's more important, prayer or peace? God should be able to hear prayers even from afar. If prayer at the Temple Mount right now risks leading to violence and strife, regardless of fair perhaps giving in to the demands of others on this issue may be best path.